What if everything you were taught about saving money is actually keeping you broke? Zach Richards breaks down why chasing a smaller budget is a dead end, and what wealthy people do instead to build real, lasting financial freedom.
Episode 1: Financial Freedom Starts with Skills, Not Sacrifice
What if the “smart” money advice you’ve heard your whole life is keeping you stuck? Our focus with this episode is all about this show’s big idea: saving can only ever get you to zero, but earning can be unlimited.
In this episode, co-host Mike Seidl interviews co-host Zach Richards, and they discuss the inspiration of the podcast. You’ll hear why Zach thinks coupon clipping and budgeting hacks are a puddle, not a plan. And he explains how investing in your skills, knowledge, and opportunities can open doors that savings alone never will.
You’ll also get Zach’s background story. He grew up solidly middle class, learning the “be careful with money” mindset, and what changed when he started thinking like a business owner. They get into risk, why relying on a W2 can feel “safe” but isn’t always, and why wealthy people talk about money… without it being bragging.
If you’ve ever felt like budgeting harder still isn’t getting you ahead, this episode is your sign. Stop trying to “save your way out” and start learning how to build.
What’s the worst money advice ever received? “Just keep money in a savings account and get ahead.”
What’s one book/podcast that changed how you think? Rich Dad, Poor Dad by Robert Kiyosaki and Sharon Lechter
What’s your guilty pleasure purchase? A giant excavator for my land to create trails and fields.
What do you do with $100,000 in passive income? Take a good chunk of it for a phone-free vacation with my wife, and reinvest the rest.
What’s one thing you wish you knew at 21? If I actually sat down and focused, how much further ahead I’d be. I wasted a lot of time.
What does financial freedom mean to you? “Time to do what I want, with who I want, where I want.”
Quotes
“If you spend your time focused on saving money, that’s where you will get your result. If you focus your time on making money, that’s where you’ll get your result.”
“Saving money is a puddle… making money is the ocean because it’s unlimited.”
“It’s worth it to invest in yourself and bet on yourself and learn new skills rather than focus on household budget and saving money.”
For Investors & the Fund – Learn how the Fund works and book a call
For Borrowers & Deals – Get funding and support for your next investment
[00:00.1]
If I have two hours in a day of, free If I have two hours in a day of, free time to think about stuff, I personally would rather think time to think about stuff, I personally would rather think about making money than thinking about saving money. about making money than thinking about saving money. Absolutely. Absolutely. Absolutely. Absolutely. Because if you spend your time focused on saving Because if you spend your time focused on saving money, that's where you will get your result.
[00:14.7]
money, that's where you will get your result. If you focus your time making money, If you focus your time making money, that's where you'll get your result. that's where you'll get your result. And for me, saving money is a puddle. And for me, saving money is a puddle. Relatively speaking, making money is the Relatively speaking, making money is the freaking ocean because it is unlimited.
[00:28.1]
freaking ocean because it is unlimited. Most people think saving money is the answer, but Most people think saving money is the answer, but the truth is saving only gets you to zero. the truth is saving only gets you to zero. Join Mike and Zach as they flip the script Join Mike and Zach as they flip the script from saving to earning, from zero to unlimited potential.
[00:41.7]
from saving to earning, from zero to unlimited potential. Welcome to Save to Zero. Welcome to Save to Zero. Hey, hey, hey, everybody. Hey, hey, hey, everybody. Here is episode number one of the Save to Zero podcast. Here is episode number one of the Save to Zero podcast. So I'm going to interview my partner Zach today so that So I'm going to interview my partner Zach today so that you can get a little feel about him as an individual.
[00:58.5]
you can get a little feel about him as an individual. Kind of what the podcast is going to be all about. Kind of what the podcast is going to be all about. And it's gonna be a lot of fun. And it's gonna be a lot of fun. So here we go. So here we go. Zach, how you doing? Good, Mike. How are you? Zach, how you doing? Good, Mike. How are you? This is exciting. This is exciting. Yeah, isn't this cool? Yeah, isn't this cool? First podcast episode of what's First podcast episode of what's gonna be like 2 million.
[01:14.4]
gonna be like 2 million. Yes, if we live that long. Yes, if we live that long. So tell, me a little bit. So tell, me a little bit. What's this podcast gonna be about? Tell everybody. What's this podcast gonna be about? Tell everybody. So the premise of this podcast, given the name Save to So the premise of this podcast, given the name Save to Zero, is that if you try to save money, if you Zero, is that if you try to save money, if you try to clip coupons, if you try to find the cheapest try to clip coupons, if you try to find the cheapest and so on, you can only save to zero.
[01:35.7]
and so on, you can only save to zero. If your household budget is 10 grand a month, for example, If your household budget is 10 grand a month, for example, the lowest you're going to get, that is to zero. the lowest you're going to get, that is to zero. And that's if you do nothing. And that's if you do nothing. But if you invest in yourself, if you learn But if you invest in yourself, if you learn new skills, if you start, a business, whatever the new skills, if you start, a business, whatever the amount of money that you can earn that you amount of money that you can earn that you can invest, all of that is infinite.
[01:55.7]
can invest, all of that is infinite. So we think it's a lot better, a lot smarter to So we think it's a lot better, a lot smarter to focus on investing in yourself, getting new skills, rather than trying focus on investing in yourself, getting new skills, rather than trying to save money, clip coupons and get to zero. to save money, clip coupons and get to zero. Yeah, but tell me how that makes sense, because you've Yeah, but tell me how that makes sense, because you've got all these famous podcasters, famous individuals who are on got all these famous podcasters, famous individuals who are on different network television stations and so on, and they're all different network television stations and so on, and they're all about teaching people how to put money safely in a about teaching people how to put money safely in a CD and how to save money on a, flight in CD and how to save money on a, flight in economy and save $50 here and there.
[02:26.7]
economy and save $50 here and there. What is this? What is this? Yeah, I think, I mean, teaching people to save money, I Yeah, I think, I mean, teaching people to save money, I think is pretty easy because you can always cut corners, you think is pretty easy because you can always cut corners, you can always take a cheaper flight and all that. can always take a cheaper flight and all that. And I think it's harder, it's And I think it's harder, it's hard to invest in yourself.
[02:42.7]
hard to invest in yourself. It's scary to invest in yourself. It's scary to invest in yourself. And take some risks and learn new skills and whatever. And take some risks and learn new skills and whatever. And I think that that's a lot And I think that that's a lot harder for people to talk about. Gotcha. harder for people to talk about. Gotcha. Okay, so let's go back in time. Okay, so let's go back in time. Tell me a little bit about your childhood, the Tell me a little bit about your childhood, the type of household that you grew up in. Sure.
[03:00.3]
type of household that you grew up in. Sure. So I grew up in New Hampshire. So I grew up in New Hampshire. My mom was a nurse, my dad was a firefighter. My mom was a nurse, my dad was a firefighter. We were solidly middle class. We were solidly middle class. I, didn't grow up with money though. I, didn't grow up with money though. We went on a couple vacations a year. We went on a couple vacations a year. My parents were very much in the saving mindset, trying My parents were very much in the saving mindset, trying to learn how to get out of debt, stay out to learn how to get out of debt, stay out of debt, save money, save for retirement, all of that.
[03:22.9]
of debt, save money, save for retirement, all of that. They're not business people, they weren't risk takers. They're not business people, they weren't risk takers. And that's what I grew up with, attitude, money wise. And that's what I grew up with, attitude, money wise. So you didn't grow up with money. I get it. So you didn't grow up with money. I get it. What is it that changed your attitude about money?
[03:36.1]
What is it that changed your attitude about money? I know I had a couple of things that I know I had a couple of things that have gone on, but tell me what changed your have gone on, but tell me what changed your attitude about making money versus saving money? attitude about making money versus saving money? So I had a couple uncles So I had a couple uncles that were both business owners. that were both business owners. And it was always really interesting being around And it was always really interesting being around them at family parties and whatnot, of seeing them at family parties and whatnot, of seeing their attitude towards money and towards their business, their attitude towards money and towards their business, towards work, how they lived.
[03:59.8]
towards work, how they lived. They always seem to have a lot They always seem to have a lot more free time on their hands. more free time on their hands. And that always planted the seed in my And that always planted the seed in my mind for, okay, maybe being a business owner. mind for, okay, maybe being a business owner. I know it's a lot of work, I know I know it's a lot of work, I know it's hard, but is probably worth it in life.
[04:11.5]
it's hard, but is probably worth it in life. So once I went into college and I was always So once I went into college and I was always interested in doing it, I ended up, doing a minor interested in doing it, I ended up, doing a minor in business and then getting my MBA because I didn't in business and then getting my MBA because I didn't know what kind of business I wanted to do.
[04:27.9]
know what kind of business I wanted to do. But I figured that, you know, getting some business But I figured that, you know, getting some business skills and some finance skills probably couldn't hurt. skills and some finance skills probably couldn't hurt. So tell me a belief that you had So tell me a belief that you had as a kid growing up and that you as a kid growing up and that you were taught that you had to completely unlearn. were taught that you had to completely unlearn. I think the biggest thing was just being I think the biggest thing was just being really, really careful with money and not taking really, really careful with money and not taking too, too many risks with it.
[04:45.6]
too, too many risks with it. And for example, when I started my private lending business And for example, when I started my private lending business five years ago, that was a big risk for me. five years ago, that was a big risk for me. I had to spend money on, you know, an attorney I had to spend money on, you know, an attorney and all this stuff to get things set up. and all this stuff to get things set up. And it was, it was spending a lot of And it was, it was spending a lot of money before I saw any sort of return.
[05:00.1]
money before I saw any sort of return. And that's something that I never would have done And that's something that I never would have done given the previous attitude that I had about money. given the previous attitude that I had about money. So you had to invest some money in So you had to invest some money in yourself that you didn't get return on? Exactly. Yes.
[05:10.8]
yourself that you didn't get return on? Exactly. Yes. It was scary at the time. It was scary at the time. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah. What's interesting is. What's interesting is. And I find this, and I heard this not too long And I find this, and I heard this not too long ago, you can buy houses, you can buy cars, you can, ago, you can buy houses, you can buy cars, you can, you can do so many different things, and you could have you can do so many different things, and you could have a lawsuit, you could have an accident, you could have bad a lawsuit, you could have an accident, you could have bad insurance, and it can all be taken from you.
[05:32.5]
insurance, and it can all be taken from you. But if you have knowledge, you can always But if you have knowledge, you can always keep using that knowledge over and over again, keep using that knowledge over and over again, and nobody can take it from you. Correct. Yeah, you'll. and nobody can take it from you. Correct. Yeah, you'll. Exactly. Exactly. That can never be taken away from you. That can never be taken away from you. So were you always entrepreneurial?
[05:46.5]
So were you always entrepreneurial? I know you talked about, you have I know you talked about, you have family members that had some businesses. family members that had some businesses. Were you always entrepreneurial? Were you always entrepreneurial? Is this a bug that you had in the Is this a bug that you had in the back of your head to grow, beyond the W2? back of your head to grow, beyond the W2? Or is this something that came about just recently, Or is this something that came about just recently, something that was an epiphany for you in the something that was an epiphany for you in the last five years when you started the business?
[06:07.8]
last five years when you started the business? So, short answer is no, So, short answer is no, I was not always entrepreneurial. I was not always entrepreneurial. I always had it sort of in my I always had it sort of in my mind that being a business owner would be mind that being a business owner would be something that would be cool to be, but. something that would be cool to be, but. But never to the point of taking any action at all.
[06:20.0]
But never to the point of taking any action at all. And it really came to the point where And it really came to the point where we, were working from home during the pandemic we, were working from home during the pandemic in my career as a software engineer. in my career as a software engineer. And I just needed something else to do. And I just needed something else to do. And I figured that.
[06:34.0]
And I figured that. I have a finance background, I know a little I have a finance background, I know a little bit about real estate investing, and then kind of bit about real estate investing, and then kind of fell into private lending and thought that this might fell into private lending and thought that this might be something that I actually could make work. be something that I actually could make work. So it was a pandemic that brought So it was a pandemic that brought you over to the dark side. It was.
[06:47.6]
you over to the dark side. It was. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah. Can you Remember the first dollar that you Can you Remember the first dollar that you ever made out of a traditional W2 job? ever made out of a traditional W2 job? The first dollar that I ever made was when I did a The first dollar that I ever made was when I did a little bit of stock trading in my freshman year of college.
[06:59.8]
little bit of stock trading in my freshman year of college. That was what I thought I was going to do because That was what I thought I was going to do because everybody, you know, day trading and all that is sexy. everybody, you know, day trading and all that is sexy. So I started. So I started. I think I started doing it with like $1,000 or I think I started doing it with like $1,000 or something like that and did it for like a month.
[07:13.8]
something like that and did it for like a month. And I didn't end up losing it all, ended up And I didn't end up losing it all, ended up just putting it into some stock and just holding it. just putting it into some stock and just holding it. I don't even remember what it was at I don't even remember what it was at the point, but I tried to day trading. the point, but I tried to day trading. And then the more I researched about it, the And then the more I researched about it, the more I realized that it doesn't work long term.
[07:26.1]
more I realized that it doesn't work long term. Yeah, I hear you. Yeah, I hear you. I hear people talk about day trading, and I got I hear people talk about day trading, and I got to step back and what I like to do is to step back and what I like to do is see someone who's successful at something and kind of copy see someone who's successful at something and kind of copy what they did or what they're doing. what they did or what they're doing. And I think to myself, if Warren And I think to myself, if Warren Buffett and Ray Dalio aren't day trading.
[07:43.4]
Buffett and Ray Dalio aren't day trading. I'm not gonna day trade. Exactly. I'm not gonna day trade. Exactly. I'm just smart as they are. I'm just smart as they are. If they can't figure it, I sure as hell can. If they can't figure it, I sure as hell can. I think people are attracted to it because, I think people are attracted to it because, yeah, you can do it from anywhere. yeah, you can do it from anywhere. You're on a computer, all you do is do You're on a computer, all you do is do a couple clicks and you make all this money a couple clicks and you make all this money.
[07:59.7]
and that's not what it's turned out to be. And, that's not what it's turned out to be. So can you remember back to a rock bottom moment So can you remember back to a rock bottom moment in your finances or your financial situation and how that in your finances or your financial situation and how that shifted you to wanting to make money and invest versus shifted you to wanting to make money and invest versus saving money and, not investing and a W2?
[08:15.7]
saving money and, not investing and a W2? I don't think I really had a rock bottom moment financial I don't think I really had a rock bottom moment financial wise, where I was like broke or anything, but I think wise where I was like broke or anything, but I think I realized back right around the time where I wanted to I realized back right around the time where I wanted to get into private lending that just working a W2 job where get into private lending that just working a W2 job where you got your paycheck every two weeks and your salary was you got your paycheck every two weeks and your salary was set by the company and you could work hard and if set by the company and you could work hard and if it was a good year, you'd get a ra.
[08:42.2]
it was a good year, you'd get a ra. If it wasn't a good year, you wouldn't. If it wasn't a good year, you wouldn't. That just kind of lost its appeal to That just kind of lost its appeal to me that I realized that I didn't have me that I realized that I didn't have any control over what my future was. any control over what my future was. And a lot of people think, oh, if you work a And a lot of people think, oh, if you work a career job and you have a steady salary, that's pretty safe.
[08:56.2]
career job and you have a steady salary, that's pretty safe. But I think it's kind of the opposite where But I think it's kind of the opposite where if you're relying on somebody else for your income, if you're relying on somebody else for your income, that's a little bit more dangerous in my mind. that's a little bit more dangerous in my mind. So that's kind of what shifted my gears, caused me So that's kind of what shifted my gears, caused me to switch gears and really want to start a business.
[09:10.4]
to switch gears and really want to start a business. So then the rock bottom moment wasn't necessarily that So then the rock bottom moment wasn't necessarily that you were at a loss financially, but you had you were at a loss financially, but you had hit a wall or, accepted the reality that I hit a wall or, accepted the reality that I don't want to rely on somebody else because they're don't want to rely on somebody else because they're in control of what my future is.
[09:27.3]
in control of what my future is. I want to be in control. I want to be in control. Did I articulate that exactly? Did I articulate that exactly? Yeah, I want to be in control Yeah, I want to be in control of my own future, my own path. of my own future, my own path. Gotcha. Gotcha. Okay, so when you're around people with money, what Okay, so when you're around people with money, what is it that you find that they or they is it that you find that they or they think differently than you used to before you started think differently than you used to before you started investing and focusing on growing money versus saving money?
[09:48.0]
investing and focusing on growing money versus saving money? I think one of the biggest things and one of I think one of the biggest things and one of the reasons that prompted us to start this podcast is the reasons that prompted us to start this podcast is a lot of middle class people don't talk about money. a lot of middle class people don't talk about money. It's some taboo topic for some reason. It's some taboo topic for some reason. And what I've noticed about being around more And what I've noticed about being around more people that are wealthy and are business owners people that are wealthy and are business owners is they talk about money all the time.
[10:08.1]
is they talk about money all the time. And to be Clear. And to be clear, they're not bragging about They're not bragging about how much money how much money they made and talking about they made and talking about how they how they make more money than somebody else. make more money than somebody else. They just understand the power of money. They just understand the power of money. They understand how money is a tool They understand how money is a tool and what it can do for people. and what it can do for people. And they talk about the different deals And they talk about the different deals they do and how they structure things.
[10:24.7]
they do and how they structure things. And I think that, not being afraid to talk And I think that, not being afraid to talk about money is a huge barrier to break. about money is a huge barrier to break. That is very helpful. That is very helpful. So let me ask you this. So let me ask you this. Have you found that your circle of people Have you found that your circle of people that you're around on a regular basis has that you're around on a regular basis has changed at all since you've, changed your focus changed at all since you've, changed your focus on money and your thoughts about it?
[10:45.6]
on money and your thoughts about it? Absolutely. Absolutely. I mean, they say what you're the average of I mean, they say what you're the average of the three people or five people or whatever it the three people or five people or whatever it is that you spend the most time with. is that you spend the most time with. And I think the exact number doesn't even matter. And I think the exact number doesn't even matter. But yeah, I've noticed that some people that But yeah, I've noticed that some people that I used to hang around with, I don't I used to hang around with, I don't hang around with as much anymore.
[11:00.6]
hang around with as much anymore. Now, I'm around a lot more. Now, I'm around a lot more. Business owners that I've met through masterminds or Business owners that I've met through masterminds or various other groups that have become friends, I various other groups that have become friends, I spend a lot of time with them. spend a lot of time with them. And then also some of the people And then also some of the people that have stayed around in my circle that have stayed around in my circle have also started talking more about money.
[11:13.9]
have also started talking more about money. And so I think it's kind of. And so I think it's kind of. I've kind of rubbed off on them a little bit. I've kind of rubbed off on them a little bit. So tell me a little bit. So tell me a little bit. What can you name one or two What can you name one or two industries that you've made money in? industries that you've made money in? I made money in real estate. I made money in real estate. The first property they ever The first property they ever bought was a rental property. bought was a rental property. We lived in one of the units and rented out the other.
[11:28.2]
We lived in one of the units and rented out the other. And, that went pretty well for us for a while. And, that went pretty well for us for a while. House hacking. House hacking. Yeah, that's very popular among people Yeah, that's very popular among people starting out in real estate. Yeah. Yeah. starting out in real estate. Yeah. Yeah. Explain to me about house hacking. Explain to me about house hacking. Break it down a little bit for people, you know, in Break it down a little bit for people, you know, in 30 seconds or less, people who have never done it before.
[11:43.7]
30 seconds or less, people who have never done it before. Yeah. Yeah. So essentially what you do is So essentially what you do is you buy a rental property. you buy a rental property. It's probably going to have to be a, two, three It's probably going to have to be a, two, three or a four unit property because it qualifies as residential. or a four unit property because it qualifies as residential. And essentially you live in one of And essentially you live in one of the units, you rent out the others.
[11:58.0]
the units, you rent out the others. And depending on if you buy it. Right. And depending on if you buy it. Right. And if it's a four unit, it's probably more And if it's a four unit, it's probably more likely to happen that you're essentially all of your likely to happen that you're essentially all of your tenants will pay your mortgage for you and you're tenants will pay your mortgage for you and you're more or less living for free. Aha. Well, that's cool. more or less living for free. Aha. Well, that's cool. That's clever.
[12:12.5]
That's clever. So can you tell me, how do you So can you tell me, how do you look at risk today versus how you looked look at risk today versus how you looked at it when you started focusing on investing? at it when you started focusing on investing? And making money versus saving money. And making money versus saving money. So I first started looking at risk as like people So I first started looking at risk as like people most commonly think about like losing money or whatever.
[12:28.7]
most commonly think about like losing money or whatever. But I've shifted, my attitude towards risk has shifted. But I've shifted, my attitude towards risk has shifted. And I see like people talk about risk in And I see like people talk about risk in the stock market a lot of, to me, risk the stock market a lot of, to me, risk is more of about volatility, for example.
[12:41.6]
is more of about volatility, for example. So if you've got a bunch of money saved in So if you've got a bunch of money saved in the stock market, you might have a couple million dollars the stock market, you might have a couple million dollars that's socked away and might be low risk. Right. that's socked away and might be low risk. Right. It's in an index fund that tracks It's in an index fund that tracks the entire stock market and all that.
[12:54.9]
the entire stock market and all that. But the risk is, if you need that money in a But the risk is, if you need that money in a year, then the stock market's probably not the best place for year, then the stock market's probably not the best place for it because over time the stock market's going to go up. it because over time the stock market's going to go up. But in the next year, year, a year from now, we could But in the next year, year, a year from now, we could be in a recession and that portfolio could drop by 50%.
[13:08.5]
be in a recession and that portfolio could drop by 50%. And is that when you really want And is that when you really want to start taking money out of it? to start taking money out of it? So my attitude towards risk has shifted So my attitude towards risk has shifted more towards consistency and less volatility in more towards consistency and less volatility in things that I want to invest in.
[13:23.1]
things that I want to invest in. So you talked about the stock market and it going So you talked about the stock market and it going up and down, kind of like, you didn't use roller up and down, kind of like, you didn't use roller coaster, but that's a term I use for the number coaster, but that's a term I use for the number of years that I was in the market. of years that I was in the market. Can you explain to people about sequence of Can you explain to people about sequence of risk that most people are very unfamiliar with? Sure.
[13:36.2]
risk that most people are very unfamiliar with? Sure. So what a lot of people have heard is you So what a lot of people have heard is you take a stock portfolio, say you save $1 million just take a stock portfolio, say you save $1 million just to make the math easy, that when you retire you to make the math easy, that when you retire you can withdraw 4% of that portfolio every single year.
[13:48.5]
can withdraw 4% of that portfolio every single year. They call that the 4% rule. They call that the 4% rule. So out of that million dollars, So out of that million dollars, you're withdrawing $40,000 every year. you're withdrawing $40,000 every year. But what that doesn't take into account is if the year But what that doesn't take into account is if the year that you happen to retire and is a, down year in that you happen to retire and is a, down year in the stock market and say it's a down year in the the stock market and say it's a down year in the economy and the next year could be down too.
[14:08.0]
economy and the next year could be down too. You're withdrawing that $40,000 and your You're withdrawing that $40,000 and your portfolio may have shrunk from a portfolio may have shrunk from a million dollars to $500,000 or $600,000. million dollars to $500,000 or $600,000. So you start withdrawing your portfolio really early on and So you start withdrawing your portfolio really early on and you start taking a huge hit out of your principal.
[14:24.4]
you start taking a huge hit out of your principal. And then before you know it, your And then before you know it, your portfolio has really gone down and you're portfolio has really gone down and you're just a couple years into retirement. just a couple years into retirement. Oh, well, that sure as heck would Oh, well, that sure as heck would scare the heck out of me. That's interesting. scare the heck out of me. That's interesting. Right before I got into investing, Right before I got into investing, that's something I hadn't thought about.
[14:40.9]
that's something I hadn't thought about. And I was in it for years in the And I was in it for years in the stock market before anybody brought that up to me. stock market before anybody brought that up to me. And it was something that never crossed my mind, And it was something that never crossed my mind, because the models are nice, that, yeah, stock market because the models are nice, that, yeah, stock market returns, on average 7 to 10% per year. returns, on average 7 to 10% per year. Whatever you want to use.
[14:55.7]
Whatever you want to use. You withdraw your 4%, you've got 3 to 6% You withdraw your 4%, you've got 3 to 6% left over or whatever, that all looks great. left over or whatever, that all looks great. But the thing is, the market does But the thing is, the market does not return that every single year. not return that every single year. Well, all right, explain that for me. Well, all right, explain that for me. They say it's an average of 10% per year.
[15:08.9]
They say it's an average of 10% per year. So let's say it goes up 10% one year So let's say it goes up 10% one year and the next year it goes down 7%. and the next year it goes down 7%. How much do I need to earn in a situation like that? How much do I need to earn in a situation like that? And if you have different number scenarios to And if you have different number scenarios to make it easier for people, that's fine.
[15:23.9]
make it easier for people, that's fine. But how much do I need to make the second year because. But how much do I need to make the second year because. Or the third year because I know Or the third year because I know 13% is not going to make it. Right. 13% is not going to make it. Right. So, yeah, let's use some bigger numbers and then So, yeah, let's use some bigger numbers and then we can make it a little bit more obvious. Right? we can make it a little bit more obvious. Right? If you've got $100,000 in some stock and say If you've got $100,000 in some stock and say it drops by 50%, now you've got $50,000, okay?
[15:41.4]
it drops by 50%, now you've got $50,000, okay? If you want to get back to where you started, a, 50% If you want to get back to where you started, a, 50% return on your $50,000 is only going to get you 75,000. return on your $50,000 is only going to get you 75,000. It's not going to get you back to 100. It's not going to get you back to 100. So you're going to need 100% return to get back to 100.
[15:55.7]
So you're going to need 100% return to get back to 100. So if you take a 50% loss, you need So if you take a 50% loss, you need to double your money just to break even. to double your money just to break even. So that's not as easy to do. So that's not as easy to do. No, that's not easy to do at all. No, that's not easy to do at all. In the stock market, that doesn't happen very In the stock market, that doesn't happen very often when it doubles in a year. Holy cow.
[16:11.2]
often when it doubles in a year. Holy cow. All right, so tell me, we'll All right, so tell me, we'll switch gears a little bit here. switch gears a little bit here. Tell me the best financial Tell me the best financial decision that you've ever made. decision that you've ever made. I think the best decision I ever made was I think the best decision I ever made was to invest in myself and start a business.
[16:24.4]
to invest in myself and start a business. Because like I talked about a little bit before, I always, Because like I talked about a little bit before, I always, thought, the way I grew up, that you work a, you, thought, the way I grew up, that you work a, you, get a good job, you work a steady career for 30 get a good job, you work a steady career for 30 years, and then you retire and that's it. years, and then you retire and that's it. But like I kind of said, you're only limited to, But like I kind of said, you're only limited to, you know, how much you can, you can earn, and you know, how much you can, you can earn, and it's harder to get, you know, extra income that way.
[16:44.1]
it's harder to get, you know, extra income that way. So the best financial advice I ever received was that So the best financial advice I ever received was that it's worth it to invest in yourself and bet on it's worth it to invest in yourself and bet on yourself and, try to learn new skills and find something yourself and, try to learn new skills and find something else to do, rather than just trying to focus on else to do, rather than just trying to focus on your household budget and saving money and all that.
[17:00.0]
your household budget and saving money and all that. What about people that are not What about people that are not interested in, leaving their profession? interested in, leaving their profession? What are some of the things that they can do What are some of the things that they can do to increase their income so that they don't have to to increase their income so that they don't have to worry about their boss deciding that they're due a raise?
[17:14.3]
worry about their boss deciding that they're due a raise? I think it makes sense to get into investing and I think it makes sense to get into investing and whether that's real estate or the stock market or whatever. whether that's real estate or the stock market or whatever. You think that makes sense for you? You think that makes sense for you? You and what you understand that having some diversification You and what you understand that having some diversification in what you're doing, and maybe you own some in what you're doing, and maybe you own some cash flowing properties or you own some stocks or cash flowing properties or you own some stocks or whatever, that gets you some diversification.
[17:35.4]
whatever, that gets you some diversification. So if something happens to the economy, something happens So if something happens to the economy, something happens to your job, you're not out of luck. to your job, you're not out of luck. Are you more of a builder or Are you more of a builder or an optimizer when it comes to money? an optimizer when it comes to money? I think the way I've started out in I think the way I've started out in life was definitely more of an optimizer.
[17:49.4]
life was definitely more of an optimizer. And looking at what I've got coming in, And looking at what I've got coming in, what I've been dealing with, budget wise, what's what I've been dealing with, budget wise, what's going on, with our household, with our finances. going on, with our household, with our finances. Did you have those nice little Did you have those nice little envelopes for all your money? envelopes for all your money? Not paper envelopes, but I have used a tool Not paper envelopes, but I have used a tool online where you can kind of budget your money, online where you can kind of budget your money, electronically into different categories and keep track of things.
[18:08.0]
electronically into different categories and keep track of things. Someone asked how much time did you Someone asked how much time did you spend on that, do you think? On average? spend on that, do you think? On average? I think probably a few hours a month, I would say. Yeah. I think probably a few hours a month, I would say. Yeah. So. So. And how many years did you do that for? And how many years did you do that for? Maybe 8, 10.
[18:24.7]
Maybe 8, 10. Okay, so if you did give or take 25 hours a Okay, so if you did give or take 25 hours a year over a eight year period of time, that was 200 year over a eight year period of time, that was 200 hours that you spent moving money around in an electronic envelope.
[18:35.3]
hours that you spent moving money around in an electronic envelope. That's right, yep. That's right, yep. If you had used that same 25 hours a year If you had used that same 25 hours a year or 200 hours in eight years, do you think you or 200 hours in eight years, do you think you could have learned a skill that would have netted you could have learned a skill that would have netted you a lot more money than you're attempting to save money?
[18:53.2]
a lot more money than you're attempting to save money? No doubt. No doubt. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. I find for me, and I was guilty I find for me, and I was guilty of it, I grew up without any money. of it, I grew up without any money. And people will hear about that in episode, number two. And people will hear about that in episode, number two. So I'm not going to get into it, but all the time So I'm not going to get into it, but all the time that you spend or that I spend trying to save money, I that you spend or that I spend trying to save money, I used to sit and try and get the cheapest airfare.
[19:14.7]
used to sit and try and get the cheapest airfare. And if it took me an extra seven hours to And if it took me an extra seven hours to fly, but I saved $100, it was worth it. fly, but I saved $100, it was worth it. And I never conceptualized, Mike, you're a dope. And I never conceptualized, Mike, you're a dope. That time is valuable.
[19:27.9]
That time is valuable. You can earn unlimited money, but your time is finite. You can earn unlimited money, but your time is finite. It's going to end at some point. It's going to end at some point. Hopefully not too far in the Hopefully not too far in the future, but it's going to end. future, but it's going to end. So if you waste your time, So if you waste your time, it's gone, you never get back.
[19:42.3]
it's gone, you never get back. Yeah, you can't get time back, Yeah, you can't get time back, but you can get money back. but you can get money back. Many people have proven that over and over again. Many people have proven that over and over again. So how has your mindset about money So how has your mindset about money changed now that you're focused on investing?
[19:55.0]
changed now that you're focused on investing? I think now that focused on investing and I think now that focused on investing and starting my own business, I've realized that making starting my own business, I've realized that making money is a lot easier than I thought. money is a lot easier than I thought. And that may sound a little bit flippant, that And that may sound a little bit flippant, that it's just, oh, it's just easy to make money.
[20:08.4]
it's just, oh, it's just easy to make money. That's not what I'm saying. That's not what I'm saying. Business is hard, but before it seemed more Business is hard, but before it seemed more or less impossible of, well, what are you or less impossible of, well, what are you going to do to make additional money? going to do to make additional money? If you're working, a salaried job or something like If you're working, a salaried job or something like that, there's really not a lot you can do. that, there's really not a lot you can do. But if your mind is open to investing But if your mind is open to investing and other things that you can do, you and other things that you can do, you realize that you can make more money.
[20:27.3]
realize that you can make more money. And it's not as unobtainable as you might think. And it's not as unobtainable as you might think. So let me ask you this question. So let me ask you this question. You are a software engineer by education, and through You are a software engineer by education, and through your W2 job that you had, can a computer your W2 job that you had, can a computer do two functions simultaneously, or does it do one do two functions simultaneously, or does it do one function at a time, very fast?
[20:44.8]
function at a time, very fast? If it has one processor in it, does one thing at If it has one processor in it, does one thing at a time and switches back and forth multiple times per second. a time and switches back and forth multiple times per second. Gotcha. Gotcha. So the human mind, to your knowledge, how many So the human mind, to your knowledge, how many tasks can the human mind do at a time?
[20:58.5]
tasks can the human mind do at a time? It can do one at a time. It can do one at a time. And this is an epiphany that I had. And this is an epiphany that I had. When it comes to time, this is my thought process. When it comes to time, this is my thought process. If I have two hours in a day of, free If I have two hours in a day of, free time to think about stuff, I personally would rather think time to think about stuff, I personally would rather think about making money than thinking about saving money.
[21:17.6]
about making money than thinking about saving money. What about you? Absolutely. Absolutely. What about you? Absolutely. Absolutely. Because if you spend your time focused on saving Because if you spend your time focused on saving money, that's where you will get your result. money, that's where you will get your result. If you focus your time making money, If you focus your time making money, that's where you'll get your result.
[21:34.0]
that's where you'll get your result. And for me, saving money is a puddle. And for me, saving money is a puddle. Relatively speaking, making money is the Relatively speaking, making money is the freaking ocean because it is unlimited. freaking ocean because it is unlimited. And saving money is not as fun. Right.
[21:48.1]
And saving money is not as fun. Right. Like you talked about with airfare. Like you talked about with airfare. I mean, would you rather make another thousand dollars I mean, would you rather make another thousand dollars or would you rather save $1,000 on a flight or would you rather save $1,000 on a flight and then have to do two layovers and sleep and then have to do two layovers and sleep in the airport and whatever else?
[22:01.0]
in the airport and whatever else? What sounds more fun? What sounds more fun? Oh, no, I like sleeping in airports on Oh, no, I like sleeping in airports, on those dirty floors, around those dirty couches or those dirty floors, around those dirty couches or seats that people have sat on from. seats that people have sat on from. Oh, okay, so that leads into the next thing.
[22:13.1]
Oh, okay. So that leads into the next thing. What does save to zero mean to you? What does save to zero mean to you? And what the heck is this goofy name of a podcast? And what the heck is this goofy name of a podcast? I think it means a lot like what we talked I think it means a lot like what we talked about, that the attitude in this country, unfortunately about money about, that the attitude in this country unfortunately about money is that it's not something to talk about.
[22:29.1]
is that it's not something to talk about. You save money in a CD in You save money in a cd in the bank and whatever until you retire. the bank and whatever until you retire. And then as inflation keeps going and eroding your And then as inflation keeps going and eroding your wealth, you just hope that you can tread water. wealth, you just hope that you can tread water. And if instead you change your mindset to earning And if instead you change your mindset to earning more, investing in yourself, getting new skills, whatever that more, investing in yourself, getting new skills, whatever that may be, it'll be a lot easier.
[22:51.1]
may be, it'll be a lot easier. Okay, so tell me, who is this podcast for? Okay, so tell me, who is this podcast for? This podcast is for small business owners, white collar This podcast is for small business owners, white collar people, blue collar people that own their own business people, blue collar people that own their own business and realize that they want more, and people wanting and realize that they want more and people wanting to learn different skills about money and life.
[23:10.4]
to learn different skills about money and life. Whether it's how to set up a trust to Whether it's how to set up a trust to protect your house if something were to happen to protect your house if something were to happen to you, or, setting up different types of retirement accounts. you, or setting up different types of retirement accounts. Maybe a self directed IRA to purchase some real estate Maybe a self directed IRA to purchase some real estate and take your money out of the stock market.
[23:25.1]
and take your money out of the stock market. Basically anybody that wants to learn more about money Basically anybody that wants to learn more about money and about personal finance and investing in yourself that and about personal finance and investing in yourself that a lot of people don't talk about. a lot of people don't talk about. So let's talk about this. So let's talk about this. You talked about having money in a self directed ira.
[23:39.2]
You talked about having money in a self directed ira. Many people aren't going to know what that means. Many people aren't going to know what that means. Tell me what a self directed IRA is. Sure. Tell me what a self directed IRA is. Sure. So to back up a little bit, everybody's familiar So to back up a little bit, everybody's familiar with an ira, like through Vanguard or Fidelity or with an IRA like through Vanguard or Fidelity or whoever else where you have tax deferred or tax whoever else where you have tax deferred or tax free money that you save for retirement.
[23:56.4]
free money that you save for retirement. You can invest that in stocks and whatnot, and You can invest that in stocks and whatnot, and then when you retire you can withdraw from it. then when you retire you can withdraw from it. But a self directed ira, it's an ira, But a self directed ira, it's an ira, it has the same tax treatment, but you it has the same tax treatment, but you open it with a custodian that allows self open it with a custodian that allows self directed investments, which perfectly legal through the irs.
[24:12.2]
directed investments, which perfectly legal through the irs. Your IRA can actually own anything except for, Your IRA can actually own anything except for, certain small business stock, life insurance or certain, certain small business stock, life insurance or certain, collectibles like paintings or things like that. collectibles like paintings or things like that. So you can take your IRA and you can lend So you can take your IRA and you can lend it to people, you can buy real estate, you can, it to people, you can buy real estate, you can, buy certain, gold coins and gold bars and whatnot.
[24:32.3]
buy certain, gold coins and gold bars and whatnot. So there's just a lot more investments out there So there's just a lot more investments out there that the big Wall street investment houses, quite frankly, that the big Wall street investment houses, quite frankly, don't want you to know about because they don't don't want you to know about because they don't make any money on it when you do it. make any money on it when you do it. So they got to make money on it or So they got to make money on it or they're not going to tell you about it. Exactly.
[24:49.5]
they're not going to tell you about it. Exactly. No. No. So what's a popular money myth that you So what's a popular money myth that you are sick and tired of hearing about? are sick and tired of hearing about? I know there are a lot out there. Yeah. To pick one. I know there are a lot out there. Yeah. To pick one. I'm sick and tired of hearing that if you I'm sick and tired of hearing that if you need need to keep cash, on hand and whatever, that to keep cash, on hand and whatever, that putting it putting it in a CD is actually an investment.
[25:08.7]
in a CD is actually an investment so say you're So say you're putting a CD, put your money in putting a CD, put your money in a CD, and a CD and it earns maybe 3 or 4%, whatever. it earns maybe 3 or 4%, whatever. But inflation is 3, 4, 5%. But inflation is 3, 4, 5%. And after the couple years that your CD And after the couple years that your CD is there, you think you've made money.
[25:24.1]
is there, you think you've made money. You've made 4% a year. You've made 4% a year. You've paid tax on 4% a year. You've paid tax on 4% a year. But because of inflation, the amount of goods But because of inflation, the amount of goods that you can actually buy has gone down. that you can actually buy has gone down. So people think that they're investing money when So people think that they're investing money when they save it in a cd, when they they save it in a cd, when they save it in the bank, and they're not.
[25:41.2]
save it in the bank, and they're not. And I'm not saying that a CD is a bad idea. And I'm not saying that a CD is a bad idea. You do need to keep some cash on hand for emergencies, You do need to keep some cash on hand for emergencies, but don't view it as an investment, because it's not. but don't view it as an investment, because it's not. Why do you think most people get stuck Why do you think most people get stuck trying to save their way to freedom financially?
[25:55.4]
trying to save their way to freedom financially? I think people get stuck because you reach a floor. I think people get stuck because you reach a floor. Right. Right. There's only so much that you can do if you're There's only so much that you can do if you're trying to, for example, cut your grocery budget down. trying to, for example, cut your grocery budget down. Right. Right. Do you want to start eating cheap processed Do you want to start eating cheap processed foods at the expense of your health? And. Probably not.
[26:11.3]
foods at the expense of your health? And. Probably not. So there's only so much. So there's only so much. Yeah, there's only so much you can save there. Yeah, there's only so much you can save there. Do you not want to go on a vacation for the next Do you not want to go on a vacation for the next 12 years just so you can save a little bit more money? 12 years just so you can save a little bit more money? I mean, your property taxes are I mean, your property taxes are going to go up every year.
[26:25.8]
going to go up every year. Your homeowner's insurance is going Your homeowner's insurance is going to go up every year. So it's just. to go up every year. So it's just. It's a hamster wheel. It's a hamster wheel. And I think that's where people get stuck. Gotcha. And I think that's where people get stuck. Gotcha. Gotcha. Gotcha. Okay, so how should people think differently Okay, so how should people think differently if they want to build some wealth? if they want to build some wealth? They need to think like we've been talking about that.
[26:40.1]
They need to think like we've been talking about that. Trying to cut out your grocery budget and Trying to cut out your grocery budget and all that is not really going to work. all that is not really going to work. Think about what your money is invested in. Think about what your money is invested in. Look at your. Look at your. You probably have a retirement You probably have a retirement account through your job. account through your job. Look at what that is that invested in bonds Look at what that is that invested in bonds that are paying you a couple percent a year, that are paying you a couple percent a year, or is it in a total stock market fund?
[26:58.6]
or is it, in a total stock market fund? Do you have some real estate? Do you have some real estate? A lot of people take their retirement account A lot of people take their retirement account and they just put it on autopilot and and they just put it on autopilot and they don't want to look at it. they don't want to look at it. They're overwhelmed by it. They're overwhelmed by it. Maybe they're afraid to look at it. Maybe they're afraid to look at it. And just putting your head in the sand And just putting your head in the sand and not thinking about that until it's too and not thinking about that until it's too late is not going to help you.
[27:14.9]
late is not going to help you. So what are some of the topics that you So what are some of the topics that you want to cover in these podcasts that people won't want to cover in these podcasts that people won't hear from their accountant or their financial advisor? hear from their accountant or their financial advisor? So I want to talk about all the things So I want to talk about all the things that we think that your average American should know that we think that your average American should know about money and investing that they don't.
[27:31.2]
about money and investing that they don't. So I think we need to talk about how you can So I think we need to talk about how you can put your house in a trust if you want to protect put your house in a trust if you want to protect that, how you can do different strategies with your ira. that, how you can do different strategies with your ira. Everybody's familiar with IRA rollovers and things like that, Everybody's familiar with IRA rollovers and things like that, but we can talk about those in more detail.
[27:47.6]
but we can talk about those in more detail. We can talk about self directed IRAs We can talk about self directed IRAs in more depth like we've touched on. in more depth like we've touched on. We can have some experts in IRAs come on there. We can have some experts in IRAs come on there. We can have accountants come on and talk We can have accountants come on and talk about various tax strategies people can use. about various tax strategies people can use. And what we want to do is just open people's eyes And what we want to do is just open people's eyes to what's possible money wise and what they may not know.
[28:05.2]
to what's possible money wise and what they may not know. Yeah. Yeah. One of the things that I'm excited about is teaching One of the things that I'm excited about is teaching people that there are many different ways to invest. people that there are many different ways to invest. You don't just have to be in a You don't just have to be in a bank, in a stock market, or a bond.
[28:18.7]
bank, in a stock market, or a bond. There are so many different options out There are so many different options out there that it gives people, many different there that it gives people, many different choices based on what their situation is. choices based on what their situation is. What do you think about that? What do you think about that? Are you looking forward to some of that? I am. Are you looking forward to some of that? I am. And I think what comes out of that too is And I think what comes out of that too is that it's not that you have to pick one strategy.
[28:34.8]
that it's not that you have to pick one strategy. We're not at all suggesting that you should take We're not at all suggesting that you should take all your money and put it into real estate all your money and put it into real estate or put it in stocks or whatever. or put it in stocks or whatever. You should probably diversify into various You should probably diversify into various things, not spreading yourself too thin. things, not spreading yourself too thin. But if you learn what's out there, you can pick But if you learn what's out there, you can pick the investment strategies that make the most sense for you.
[28:49.7]
the investment strategies that make the most sense for you. Yeah, that's one of the things that I Yeah, that's one of the things that I heard years ago is that wealthy people do heard years ago is that wealthy people do not have just one source of income. not have just one source of income. They have multiple sources of income. They have multiple sources of income. And one of the things that, I had explained to me And one of the things that, I had explained to me as an analogy one time is that with an engine, it as an analogy one time is that with an engine, it can't fire all eight cylinders at the same time.
[29:08.0]
can't fire all eight cylinders at the same time. It has to fire four and four. It has to fire four and four. And the reason for that is if they all And the reason for that is if they all fire at the same time, the engine explodes. fire at the same time, the engine explodes. So it's the same thing with investing. So it's the same thing with investing. Everything is not going to be at Everything is not going to be at the top at the same time.
[29:24.3]
the top at the same time. Something's up, something's down, but you're Something's up, something's down, but you're always bringing in income because you always bringing in income because you have different sources of income. have different sources of income. So is that something that you started to think of So is that something that you started to think of when you diversified away from when you had a W2 when you diversified away from when you had a W2 job in the way that you invest now?
[29:37.4]
job in the way that you invest now? Yes, absolutely. Yes, absolutely. It helped me sleep at night. It helped me sleep at night. The most is I realized that if I had The most is I realized that if I had one investment that was doing well and then all one investment that was doing well and then all of a sudden it wasn't doing as well, I of a sudden it wasn't doing as well, I had something else that could take its place. had something else that could take its place. That made it a lot easier when you have all That made it a lot easier when you have all these different streams of income that you don't have to.
[29:52.5]
these different streams of income that you don't have to. You don't have to be as worried. You don't have to be as worried. Explain a little bit about what your personal investment strategy Explain a little bit about what your personal investment strategy is today and how it has evolved over time. is today and how it has evolved over time. So, for me, I'm really focused on things that do not require a So, for me, I'm really focused on things that do not require a lot of my time and do not add a lot of stress.
[30:09.5]
lot of my time and do not add a lot of stress. And you want to make money while you're sleeping. And you want to make money while you're sleeping. Exactly. Exactly. That's exactly what I want to do. That's exactly what I want to do. I want to make money while I'm sleeping, I want to make money while I'm sleeping, and I want to have investments that don't and I want to have investments that don't bother me on a weekend, for example. Right.
[30:23.3]
bother me on a weekend, for example. Right. Like, I used to own that Like, I used to own that rental property that I talked about. rental property that I talked about. And once in a while you get And once in a while you get calls about something wasn't working, something was calls about something wasn't working, something was leaking, this and that, whatever. leaking, this and that, whatever. But then when you diversify into, you know, say you But then when you diversify into, you know, say you own real estate, passively investing with somebody else, or you own real estate, passively investing with somebody else, or you do private lending or whatever, in private lending, if you do private lending or whatever, in private lending, if you have insurance on the property, if it burns down, you have insurance on the property, if it burns down, you don't need to be worried about it until Monday when don't need to be worried about it until Monday when the insurance company calls you and asks where you want the insurance company calls you and asks where you want them to send the check.
[30:54.7]
them to send the check. And so for me, it's just about things that don't stress And so for me, it's just about things that don't stress me out and don't require a lot of my time. me out and don't require a lot of my time. So do you see the podcast being tactical, motivational, real So do you see the podcast being tactical, motivational, real life stories focused on one area of the other? life stories focused on one area of the other? Do you see a combination?
[31:09.3]
Do you see a combination? What do you want to see happen? What do you want to see happen? I want it to be a combination of all these things. I want it to be a combination of all these things. Definitely some tactical advice if we want Definitely some tactical advice if we want to talk about a specific subject. to talk about a specific subject. But then also more strategic things of like, like, But then also more strategic things of like, like, you know, how to think about money and maybe you know, how to think about money and maybe some strategies that people hadn't had in mind.
[31:23.3]
some strategies that people hadn't had in mind. And then people tell their own personal And then people tell their own personal stories about how they became an entrepreneur. stories about how they became an entrepreneur. Nobody's, born with their own business. Nobody's born with their own business. On day one, everybody, you know, On day one, everybody, you know, figures out their own path. figures out their own path. And every time you hear a story like that And every time you hear a story like that about somebody, you can always pick up some advice about somebody, you can always pick up some advice along the way for what they learned, what worked along the way for what they learned, what worked for them and what didn't work for them.
[31:43.9]
for them and what didn't work for them. So I think talking all those different things is So I think talking all those different things is going to be exactly what people can expect. going to be exactly what people can expect. So here's a big one. So here's a big one. What do you not expect this podcast to be? What do you not expect this podcast to be? This podcast is not going to be a deep This podcast is not going to be a deep dive into any one thing over multiple episodes.
[32:01.0]
dive into any one thing over multiple episodes. For example, we, Mike and I, are private lenders. For example, we, Mike and I, are private lenders. This is not a podcast about private lending. This is not a podcast about private lending. We're not going to be talking about how we do We're not going to be talking about how we do loans and all of that, because quite frankly, there's not loans and all of that, because quite frankly, there's not a whole lot that we can talk about for an a whole lot that we can talk about for an entire podcast and make it very interesting.
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entire podcast and make it very interesting. Lending is boring. Lending is boring. We want to get other guests on with all We want to get other guests on with all the other things that we've been talking about. the other things that we've been talking about. What's one reason you think that, we're going What's one reason you think that, we're going to be a good duo on this podcast? I think we have to be a good duo on this podcast? I think we have different backgrounds, different experiences.
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different backgrounds, different experiences. You've owned multiple businesses throughout your life and to You've owned multiple businesses throughout your life and, to my knowledge, have never had a corporate job. my knowledge, have never had a corporate job. And, and for me, yeah, I have had a corporate job and And, and for me, yeah, I have had a corporate job and have had to, think about how to break away from that.
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have had to, think about how to break away from that. And that's been a big mindset shift. And that's been a big mindset shift. So I think this will be So I think this will be, an exciting combination for doing this. an exciting combination for doing this. Do you have any controversial money opinions you'd Do you have any controversial money opinions you'd like to share right out of the gate? like to share right out of the gate? Yeah, I think the most controversial money opinion I Yeah, I think the most controversial money opinion I have is that I actually don't disagree with a have is that I actually don't disagree with a lot of the stuff that Dave Ramsey says.
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lot of the stuff that Dave Ramsey says. I think that he is, for lack of a better I think that he is, for lack of a better term, excuse me everybody, he's swearing at me now. term, excuse me everybody, he's swearing at me now. It's sort of like AA for personal, finance. It's sort of like AA for personal, finance. And what I mean by that is anybody that And what I mean by that is anybody that really understands what they're doing knows that how he really understands what they're doing knows that how he suggests paying off your debts from smallest to largest suggests paying off your debts from smallest to largest is not the mathematically optimal thing to do.
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is not the mathematically optimal thing to do. And I completely agree with that. That's true. And I completely agree with that. That's true. But who he's talking to are the But who he's talking to are the people that, that are drowning in debt. people that, that are drowning in debt. They have all these bills, stuff is in collections and They have all these bills, stuff is in collections and for them, if they have a $200 store credit card for them, if they have a $200 store credit card bill that they haven't been paying, if they pay that bill that they haven't been paying, if they pay that off, that gives them a huge psychological boost that this off, that gives them a huge psychological boost that this is actually something that they can do and it makes is actually something that they can do and it makes it a lot easier to keep momentum going.
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it a lot easier to keep momentum going. It's just like if you're going to go from It's just like if you're going to go from sitting on the couch to running a marathon, you're sitting on the couch to running a marathon, you're not gonna go run a marathon tomorrow. not gonna go run a marathon tomorrow. You're gonna start, start walking down to the mailbox You're gonna start, start walking down to the mailbox and back depending on where you are in life.
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and back depending on where you are in life. And I think his advice, is the exact same thing. And I think his advice is the exact same thing. What's one episode topic that you're dying to record? What's one episode topic that you're dying to record? I'm really looking forward to having an I'm really looking forward to having an expert in self directed IRAs on.
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expert in self directed IRAs on. When I set myself up with one 5 years When I set myself up with one 5 years ago, I realized how powerful they were and how ago, I realized how powerful they were and how they completely broke the mold of what I, I they completely broke the mold of what I, I thought I could save for retirement on. thought I could save for retirement on. And since then I've helped my mom set one up, And since then I've helped my mom set one up, I've helped, my aunt, my uncle set one up, I've I've helped, my aunt, my uncle set one up.
[34:42.2]
I've helped various people in our helped various people in our investor community set them up. investor community set them up. And I think that that is probably the And I think that that is probably the single most powerful tool that people can use single most powerful tool that people can use to take control of their own retirement. to take control of their own retirement. And I really want to spread that news to people. And I really want to spread that news to people. Awesome. Awesome. All right, now, I wrote down about a half All right, now, I wrote down about a half a dozen rapid fire questions, so you have to a dozen rapid fire questions, so you have to answer them in two seconds or less. All right.
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answer them in two seconds or less. All right. I'm just kidd. I'm just kidd. It doesn't have to be two seconds or less, It doesn't have to be two seconds or less, but I am going to rapid fire you. but I am going to rapid fire you. Okay, so let me get out my list before I so Okay, so let me get out my list before I. So I don't forget anything and I don't forget anything and I don't throw off the timing. I don't throw off the timing. What's the worst money advice you've ever received? What's the worst money advice you've ever received? The worst money. Next question.
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The worst money. Next question. All right, sorry, guys. Let's do this again. All right, sorry, guys. Let's do this again. I just want to have a little fun. I just want to have a little fun. What's the worst money advice you've ever received? What's the worst money advice you've ever received? The worst money advice that I've ever received The worst money advice that I've ever received is that you can keep money in a is that you can keep money in a savings account and get ahead dad.
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savings account and get ahead dad. Good one. Good one. I love that. I love that. What's one book of podcasts that change how you think? What's one book of podcasts that change how you think? People say this all the time, but People say this all the time, but I think it's for a good reason. I think it's for a good reason. The first book that I read that really changed my mindset The first book that I read that really changed my mindset here was Rich Dad, Poor dad talked about the contrast between here was Rich dad, Poor dad talked about the contrast between a business owner and an employee and really set the stage a business owner and an employee and really set the stage for me and how I think about money now. Absolutely.
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for me and how I think about money now. Absolutely. A classic. I don't know. A classic. I don't know. I can't name five people that I know that are I can't name five people that I know that are wealthy that aren't familiar with Rich Dad, Poor Dad. wealthy, that aren't familiar with Rich Dad, Poor Dad. Haven't read it. Haven't read it. So I'm, with you, man. So I'm, with you, man. So what's your guilty pleasure? Purchase. So what's your guilty pleasure? Purchase. What do you have in your head that you What do you have in your head that you want to purchase that you know, you don't really want to purchase that you know, you don't really have to, but it's going to be guilty pleasure have to, but it's going to be guilty pleasure and that you're going to purchase.
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and that you're going to purchase. So I live on about 40 acres up in New So I live on about 40 acres up in New Hampshire and what I really want to get is a Hampshire and what I really want to get is a big excavator so that I can put trails and fields big excavator so that I can put trails and fields and all kinds of stuff on my property. and all kinds of stuff on my property. And that's probably something that costs And that's probably something that costs a couple hundred thousand dollars.
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a couple hundred thousand dollars. Dude, I want to party with you. Dude, I want to party with you. Who the heck says excavator? That's, cool. I love it. Who the heck says excavator? That's cool. I love it. So if you got a hundred thousand dollars, So if you got a hundred thousand dollars, if you got 100,000 in passive income today, if you got 100,000 in passive income today, what would you do with it?
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what would you do with it? I would take a chunk of it, a good chunk I would take a chunk of it, a good chunk of it, and go on a few week vacation with of it, and go on a few week vacation with my wife, no phone, and just relax, enjoy myself, unplug. my wife, no phone, and just relax, enjoy myself, unplug. And then I would take the rest of And then I would take the rest of that, assuming there's some leftover, and reinvest it.
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that, assuming there's some leftover, and reinvest it. Nice vacation for $100,000. Good for you. Nice vacation for $100,000. Good for you. What's one thing you wish you knew What's one thing you wish you knew at 21 that you know now. at 21 that, you know now. I wish I knew that if I actually in business and I wish I knew that if I actually in business and everything and sat down and really focused and wasn't so nervous everything and sat down and really focused and wasn't so nervous about jumping in, how much I wish I knew how much about jumping in, how much I wish I knew how much further ahead I would be than I was now.
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further ahead I would be than I was now. I feel like thinking back on myself I feel like thinking back on myself that I wasted a lot of time. that I wasted a lot of time. And I hate comparing myself to other business owners, but And I hate comparing myself to other business owners, but sometimes you see people start a business in just a sometimes you see people start a business in just a couple years and get really far, and I just. couple years and get really far, and I just. If I could go back and change If I could go back and change it, that's what I would do. Yeah.
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it, that's what I would do. Yeah. But I got to tell you, though, for But I got to tell you, though, for me, I get down that rabbit hole, too. me, I get down that rabbit hole, too. And what I have to say to myself is And what I have to say to myself is I have yet to meet somebody who was successful I have yet to meet somebody who was successful at anything that didn't say the exact same thing. at anything that didn't say the exact same thing. That's true. That's true. Because it's easy.
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Because it's easy. Steve Jobs said this. Steve Jobs said this. It's easy to look back and see the picture, but It's easy to look back and see the picture, but when you have the pieces in front of you, you when you have the pieces in front of you, you can't see the picture until they're all together. can't see the picture until they're all together. And the only way to see them And the only way to see them all together is to look back. Exactly. all together is to look back. Exactly. That's exactly right. That's exactly right. What, in one sentence, what does What, in one sentence, what does financial freedom mean to you?
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financial freedom mean to you? Financial freedom, for me is the time to do what Financial freedom, for me is the time to do what I want with who I want and where I want. I want with who I want and where I want. Boom. All right, man. That is it. Boom. All right, man. That is it. We are done with episode number one, everybody.
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We are done with episode number one, everybody. Hopefully, this gives you an idea of what we got coming Hopefully, this gives you an idea of what we got coming your way, and we think you're going to learn from it. your way, and we think you're going to learn from it. We know we're going to have some people on here. We know we're going to have some people on here. You're going to learn some stuff, some gold nuggets You're going to learn some stuff, some gold nuggets that you can take and take action on. On. that you can take and take action on. On. But remember, knowledge is nice.
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But remember, knowledge is nice. It doesn't mean anything without action. It doesn't mean anything without action. So till the next episode. So till the next episode. Have a good one. Zach. Have a good one, Zach. Sign off, buddy. Sign off, buddy. All right, guys, thanks for listening, and we're All right, guys, thanks for, listening, and we're looking forward to what we've got coming up. Boom. looking forward to what we've got coming up. Boom.